Great job addressing the pain points that sketch has. I think this has a lot of potential to make a big impact on product design.
However, the kickstarter method seems very odd to me. I have a hard time being willing to spend $100 on a piece of software that I've never used. There's been a number of design tools that have come out recently, which have looked promising but have fallen flat as soon as I tried to integrate them into my workflow (which, btw, all hinges on sketch).
I'm wondering why they're not opening this up for beta, gaining users, working out bugs, getting people to love the tool, and then charging for it? I've not seen someone try to fund software like this before, and personally will be waiting until it's a real product before putting up the cash.
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@tomjohndesign They will quickly learn their lesson when no one backs them.... I agree...it should be a free beta that transforms into a pay model once it has proven itself.
Right now they are just selling dreams and rainbows...
@metalhaze They could meet their funding goals, and I hope they do. I'd love to see some new ideas in this space.
Buuuut it really seems like a backwards strategy. I mean, they're competing in a crowded space with some great products, who have user loyalty, robust ecosystems, developer support, tons of community created content, tutorials, a low learning curve, and all of which have free trials.
Not to mention the fact that most of us have already spent the last year or longer migrating our content from photoshop/illustrator/etc over to sketch. Even if this thing is a huge productivity boon, I don't know if I'd be able to justify the time to migrate all of my current work... even if it was free to start with.
Thanks for the hunt, Kevin!
Kevin Lynagh and I started working on Subform over a year ago, frustrated with the limitations of print-based design tooling for building complex UIs. We’ve since talked with hundreds of designers and front-end developers about their design process—and what they wish design tools could do. Subform is the end result of those conversations.
I'm obviously biased, but having access to a true layout engine at design-time has been amazing. It feels like the future. We're excited to get it in everybody's hands.
If you have any questions, just reply---I'll be around today.
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@ryanlucas Hey Ryan, I posted this over on Kickstarter as well, but feel free to answer it here instead. I'm really excited that you guys are seeking funding to make Subform a reality, but two questions I have, based on some frustration with other new apps I've tried, are:
1. What's the current support for working with SVGs within Subform?
2. Will Subform be able to work with/import other file formats like .ai or .sketch?
@jmwlsn I think Kevin just posted an answer for you over on the Kickstarter page. Let me know if you have more questions.
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Our team is closely watching Subform. We need to iterate constantly and output HTML or InVision prototypes or wireframes that just can't show what we need them to show - Subform will reduce our design time, let us test/iterate against the output, and ultimately would enable us define the responsive spectrum against viewport sizes and content. I'm rooting for this because I see a huge gap that this realistically fills.
You definitely addressed the problems I have designing for web and mobile, but I wonder if these are just updates to Sketch or if they justify an entirely new product?
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@joshuapinter Sketch seems like they are on a different trajectory, pursuing the perfect vector tool as a means of handling resizes. It's a good product, but symbols can get out of hand quickly, when trying to maintain states and multiple art boards.
@jasonkylescott Completely agree - the lack of properly handling symbols and states is my biggest gripe with Sketch. Not sure about their trajectory, but you could be very right.
you guys nailed some of the pain we're still having with tools like sketch. ‘relationships and rules’ looks like an awesome approach instead of pushing pixels! nice work @ryanlucas
@thebent Thanks, Ben! Look forward to talking to you more about it and hearing your thoughts.
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I've been following Subform (BoxBox) for a long time now and am super excited to back it. Personally, I'm really unhappy with my options for web design tools and this product aims to address every single pain point I've encountered—mainly the absence of responsive artboards and relational positioning.
While I understand a lot of the points being made about Kickstarter, I also think this approach has the potential to garner them a small but highly engaged group of early-adopters that can truly help shape the product into a viable alternative to current tools. In my opinion, a lot of the new tools that have had wide beta releases, might have done well to limit their initial releases in order to hone the product before making any bad first impressions.
But, we'll see. I've happily backed them and I really hope they reach their goals!
@jmwlsn Hope they're able to make it work. I'm literally having issues with all of the problems that they describe right this moment, and I know I'm not alone. Just hope that the kickstarter campaign wasn't the wrong gamble and they can deliver on their promo videos.
@elizabethhunker@subformapp@kwdinc It's possible we'll still run into unforeseen difficulties with our Chinese manufacturing partner. ;)
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Hunter
Subform is a CAD-inspired design tool focused on the unique constraints of UX/UI design. It empowers designers to create responsive layouts, enforce consistent styles, build stateful components, and work with real content—all inside of a familiar, desktop-based visual design environment.
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